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Topic: do you think that lord berus can destroy the very universe with just 1 blow?  (Read 3185 times)

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i think that if elder kai was sealed by berus in the Z sword, he knows very well what level cap berus is, so i think he is right, and he can destroy all the universe, but just with 100% of his power.

    Offline Kiyza

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It's implied that he can destroy a solar system, I believe. Most power level fanatics fail to realize there's no discernable difference between destroying a star and a solar system outside of the attack's range, as a star makes up more than 99% of the mass in a star system, provided it's a single star system and not a binary, triplet, or any other multi-star system (which are actually more common than single stars).

By the way, I'm the resident Marvel/DC/western comics in general fan here (and the only one, at the moment) and I hate how some sects of the Dragon Ball fandom is salty toward us. Most of us don't give a shit about power levels and many get made fun of for bringing them up in any serious context, outside of the occasional discussion of things like cosmic hierarchies and that *insert powerful character here* shouldn't be tossed around like a ragdoll during events to make the villain of the moment seem more threatening. (And that's purely situational and depends on the writing)

The vocal minority doesn't speak for the majority, and no comic book fan discussing power levels would ever say that Beerus can't destroy a city or whatever. They're just more liable than anime fans to demand direct, visual evidence because cape comics don't care about A > B > C with a handful of exceptions when characters have the same power sets. (Heralds of Galactus come to mind, but the gaps between them are nowhere near as large as some people believe -- it stems from ignorance)

I've personally had the ability to seriously care about power levels knocked out of me by the levels of naughtyword present in some comics I've read. The notion of Beerus being able to destroy a universe with a single attack is nonsensical because there's nothing to support the notion, but lordy, I have seen characters destroy the universe (or more) before and they make Dragon Ball on the whole look like a joke. That's not the realm of brute strength, it's the realm of reality-warping, and many fail to realize that.


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It's implied that he can destroy a solar system, I believe. Most power level fanatics fail to realize there's no discernable difference between destroying a star and a solar system outside of the attack's range, as a star makes up more than 99% of the mass in a star system, provided it's a single star system and not a binary, triplet, or any other multi-star system (which are actually more common than single stars).

By the way, I'm the resident Marvel/DC/western comics in general fan here (and the only one, at the moment) and I hate how some sects of the Dragon Ball fandom is salty toward us. Most of us don't give a shit about power levels and many get made fun of for bringing them up in any serious context, outside of the occasional discussion of things like cosmic hierarchies and that *insert powerful character here* shouldn't be tossed around like a ragdoll during events to make the villain of the moment seem more threatening. (And that's purely situational and depends on the writing)

The vocal minority doesn't speak for the majority, and no comic book fan discussing power levels would ever say that Beerus can't destroy a city or whatever. They're just more liable than anime fans to demand direct, visual evidence because cape comics don't care about A > B > C with a handful of exceptions when characters have the same power sets. (Heralds of Galactus come to mind, but the gaps between them are nowhere near as large as some people believe -- it stems from ignorance)

I've personally had the ability to seriously care about power levels knocked out of me by the levels of popo present in some comics I've read. The notion of Beerus being able to destroy a universe with a single attack is nonsensical because there's nothing to support the notion, but lordy, I have seen characters destroy the universe (or more) before and they make Dragon Ball on the whole look like a joke. That's not the realm of brute strength, it's the realm of reality-warping, and many fail to realize that.


here on brazil, we have a very familiar chanel as the ''screw atack'', and while ago they make what screw atack calls a ''death match'' that has the same name in portuguese ''batalha mortal'', and they make batman (with prepare) agaist goku, and by some way they said that batman kills goku, because he can make he sleep with one type of poison, then kill him in one shoot with a gun, the only mensure to the power of a super saiyan god, its the power of beerus, or virse versa, they said that goku ssjgssj would die like this, for the normal batman, because he can ''lure'' goku in a trap, and kill him with poison, to make him sleep, and give a fatality with a normal gun.

    Offline Kiyza

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here on brazil, we have a very familiar chanel as the ''screw atack'', and while ago they make what screw atack calls a ''death match'' that has the same name in portuguese ''batalha mortal'', and they make batman (with prepare) agaist goku, and by some way they said that batman kills goku, because he can make he sleep with one type of poison, then kill him in one shoot with a gun, the only mensure to the power of a super saiyan god, its the power of beerus, or virse versa, they said that goku ssjgssj would die like this, for the normal batman, because he can ''lure'' goku in a trap, and kill him with poison, to make him sleep, and give a fatality with a normal gun.

Well, this is actually something that stems from an inside joke among comic fans. See, Batman's preparation skills are nothing short of legendary because he's the guy with the plan. It's how he manages to be the only "normal" person on the standard Justice League of America roster. He's the team strategist. The smart guy. This got blow out of proportion when Grant Morrison, surrealist comic book writer cosmic wizard started writing Batman. You see, Morrison sees cape comics as a sort of modern form of mythology, and compares characters like Batman and Superman to mythological figures. His stories drip with metaphor of all sorts, and he exaggerates Batman's preparation skills, culminating in his Final Crisis storyline, which is about Darkseid finally figuring out the Anti-Life equation he's coveted for so many years of publication. What exactly happens is rather complex, but it's arguably the main reason Batman's prep skills are legendary.

My point is, it's kind of like a comic book inside joke or tall tale. Non-fans tend to blow it out of proportion. Most people will generally agree that the real master of prep time is Thanos anyway, whose ability to nearly destroy existence with sufficient time to prepare and the right MacGuffin is tried, true and consistent.


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It's how he manages to be the only "normal" person on the standard Justice League of America roster.

What about Green Arrow? Don't hate me for now knowing about it since I'm not a big DC fan but I think he's like Batman since he has the power of money.
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    Offline Roxas

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What about Green Arrow? Don't hate me for now knowing about it since I'm not a big DC fan but I think he's like Batman since he has the power of money.
Very similar but I wouldn't put him on the same level as batman when it comes to smarts and training though they both sort of have the same gimmick going on. Green Arrow doesn't really brood either.

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Well, this is actually something that stems from an inside joke among comic fans. See, Batman's preparation skills are nothing short of legendary because he's the guy with the plan. It's how he manages to be the only "normal" person on the standard Justice League of America roster. He's the team strategist. The smart guy. This got blow out of proportion when Grant Morrison, surrealist comic book writer cosmic wizard started writing Batman. You see, Morrison sees cape comics as a sort of modern form of mythology, and compares characters like Batman and Superman to mythological figures. His stories drip with metaphor of all sorts, and he exaggerates Batman's preparation skills, culminating in his Final Crisis storyline, which is about Darkseid finally figuring out the Anti-Life equation he's coveted for so many years of publication. What exactly happens is rather complex, but it's arguably the main reason Batman's prep skills are legendary.

My point is, it's kind of like a comic book inside joke or tall tale. Non-fans tend to blow it out of proportion. Most people will generally agree that the real master of prep time is Thanos anyway, whose ability to nearly destroy existence with sufficient time to prepare and the right MacGuffin is tried, true and consistent.



i dont know very well, but i heard that batman became a god, and now he can know everything in the universe, because he sits in the throne of someone, what is that ?.

    Offline Kiyza

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What about Green Arrow? Don't hate me for now knowing about it since I'm not a big DC fan but I think he's like Batman since he has the power of money.

When I say "standard roster", I'm talking mostly about the "Big Seven" -- Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, Aquaman, Green Lantern (Hal Jordan), the Flash (Barry Allen), and the Martian Manhunter -- though the roster obviously rotates a lot. Ollie's on the team some of the time, but he's not nearly as prevalent as Batman or the other guys. There a lot of JLA regulars who have no powers or have money as their main power, though.

Very similar but I wouldn't put him on the same level as batman when it comes to smarts and training though they both sort of have the same gimmick going on. Green Arrow doesn't really brood either.

Yes he does. You would too if your sidekick was a drug addict and your best friend turned into a supervillain who tried to destroy the universe and semi succeeded.

i dont know very well, but i heard that batman became a god, and now he can know everything in the universe, because he sits in the throne of someone, what is that ?.

Ah, this. Bats is currently sitting on Metron's (on of the New Gods) chair, and sitting on this chair makes your basically omniscient in a sense. It seems to actually be an inside joke of a sort, since they make direct references to the phrase "Batgod", which is the term used to describe Grant Morrison's interpretation of moody broody dark and gloomy.

Did this become a DC thread for some reason?


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    Offline Tofu

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Did this become a DC thread for some reason?

I'm wondering this same thing! Damn it Kiyza, you broke it.
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When I say "standard roster", I'm talking mostly about the "Big Seven" -- Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, Aquaman, Green Lantern (Hal Jordan), the Flash (Barry Allen), and the Martian Manhunter -- though the roster obviously rotates a lot. Ollie's on the team some of the time, but he's not nearly as prevalent as Batman or the other guys. There a lot of JLA regulars who have no powers or have money as their main power, though.

Yes he does. You would too if your sidekick was a drug addict and your best friend turned into a supervillain who tried to destroy the universe and semi succeeded.

Ah, this. Bats is currently sitting on Metron's (on of the New Gods) chair, and sitting on this chair makes your basically omniscient in a sense. It seems to actually be an inside joke of a sort, since they make direct references to the phrase "Batgod", which is the term used to describe Grant Morrison's interpretation of moody broody dark and gloomy.

Did this become a DC thread for some reason?



its because we dont know a lot of dc, marvel, and you seems to know something, and the point that i make this request, was to know how strong lord berus is, in the eyes of dbr community, the only one that can mensure goku ssj god's power is lord berus, and we dont know how strong he is, or even whiss.

do you think that lord berus can destroy the very universe with just 1 blow?
« Reply #10 on: August 06, 2015, 02:57:05 PM »

    Offline chano

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the only one that can mensure goku ssj god's power is lord berus, and we dont know how strong he is, or even whiss.
actually, some time ago when battle of gods came out, akira made a measurement of power where ssjg had like 7 points beerus like 11 and whiss like 14, something like that, idk if that is what you are asking for

...it ain't about how hard you hit, it's about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward...

do you think that lord berus can destroy the very universe with just 1 blow?
« Reply #11 on: August 06, 2015, 02:59:58 PM »

    Offline Kiyza

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I'm wondering this same thing! Damn it Kiyza, you broke it.

Well, look at it this way. At least I didn't break the universe.

Spoiler for Okay, multiverse technically. Or rather, what was left of it... :







From Crisis on Infinite Earths #10. Script by Marv Wolfman, art by George Perez.

its because we dont know a lot of dc, marvel, and you seems to know something, and the point that i make this request, was to know how strong lord berus is, in the eyes of dbr community, the only one that can mensure goku ssj god's power is lord berus, and we dont know how strong he is, or even whiss.

I'm actually not as knowledgeable as I seem on the surface, walking encyclopedia though I may appear to be, but I do what I can.

Anyway, my simple stance on the matter is this. If you want me to believe that Beerus can destroy the universe, back it up with something like the sequence above. I can tell you right that the Brazilian translation is inaccurate, since mistranslations of the line about whatever it is Pudding Cat can destroy are abundant. I can't remember what the actual line was (I think it was a solar system, but don't quote me on that), but I know it was less than a galaxy, and certainly not a universe. If the claim isn't backed up by a credible source of information, I have every reason to ignore it outright until I see it actually displayed. I think it's generally best to assume the worst when you have nothing else to go by.

This, of course, is a form of logic that doesn't often sit well with Dragon Ball fans heavily focused on the power level aspect of the series, as strength is generally implied rather than shown. This actually tends to be true for most works of fiction dealing with characters who can destroy planets and the like, but comics from Marvel and DC have the unique benefit of having been around for long time. The Spectre -- the speedo-wearing ghost in the scans above -- is 75 years old now and he's had quite a few solo series in that span of time to showcase his absurdity or relative lack thereof. (This is, for the record, the character that forcibly exorcised the ability to care about power levels from me) The fact that Dragon Ball has no scenes in it that directly showcase a character's ability to, say, destroy a star, tends to piss off fans when they're asked for proof of a character's abilities and all they have to back it up are quotes instead of something flashy like I just showed.

actually, some time ago when battle of gods came out, akira made a measurement of power where ssjg had like 7 points beerus like 11 and whiss like 14, something like that, idk if that is what you are asking for

Yes, but you'd still need to know the limits of Beerus's strength to make any sort of valid comparison.


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do you think that lord berus can destroy the very universe with just 1 blow?
« Reply #12 on: August 07, 2015, 02:30:48 AM »
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Well, look at it this way. At least I didn't break the universe.

Spoiler for Okay, multiverse technically. Or rather, what was left of it... :







From Crisis on Infinite Earths #10. Script by Marv Wolfman, art by George Perez.

I'm actually not as knowledgeable as I seem on the surface, walking encyclopedia though I may appear to be, but I do what I can.

Anyway, my simple stance on the matter is this. If you want me to believe that Beerus can destroy the universe, back it up with something like the sequence above. I can tell you right that the Brazilian translation is inaccurate, since mistranslations of the line about whatever it is Pudding Cat can destroy are abundant. I can't remember what the actual line was (I think it was a solar system, but don't quote me on that), but I know it was less than a galaxy, and certainly not a universe. If the claim isn't backed up by a credible source of information, I have every reason to ignore it outright until I see it actually displayed. I think it's generally best to assume the worst when you have nothing else to go by.

This, of course, is a form of logic that doesn't often sit well with Dragon Ball fans heavily focused on the power level aspect of the series, as strength is generally implied rather than shown. This actually tends to be true for most works of fiction dealing with characters who can destroy planets and the like, but comics from Marvel and DC have the unique benefit of having been around for long time. The Spectre -- the speedo-wearing ghost in the scans above -- is 75 years old now and he's had quite a few solo series in that span of time to showcase his absurdity or relative lack thereof. (This is, for the record, the character that forcibly exorcised the ability to care about power levels from me) The fact that Dragon Ball has no scenes in it that directly showcase a character's ability to, say, destroy a star, tends to piss off fans when they're asked for proof of a character's abilities and all they have to back it up are quotes instead of something flashy like I just showed.

Yes, but you'd still need to know the limits of Beerus's strength to make any sort of valid comparison.


this was my point, we dont know the power of berus, because he only battle with ssjgod, and we dont know the power of ssjgod, because him only battle with berus, its kinda boring, and dc, marvel are there for a long time ago, i think that batman and superman are like 75-80 years too, the why we think that he can maybe destroy the universe, its because akira aways make a enemy 100x+ stronger than the previous, we have nothing yet, just our hope, the power level of divines in dc, marvel, its far away that a dbz character can doo,                                                                                                                                       


in this same chanel that make batman (with prepare) agaist goku, they also make berus vs saga (saint seya episode G), the problem here  is that this channel aways try to make dbz characters go down, they also aways says that maybe not even berus can fight in the light speed, i'm not a fanatic to say that a dbz character can go agaist a god from dc, marvel, but they are not this weak that some people think too.

do you think that lord berus can destroy the very universe with just 1 blow?
« Reply #13 on: August 07, 2015, 03:02:44 AM »

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no, if he could destroy anything, it would be the solar system.

But imagine if this is only his 1st form, and he is like a Frieza... oooooooo tingly
« Last Edit: August 07, 2015, 03:06:24 AM by DelmoonXz »

do you think that lord berus can destroy the very universe with just 1 blow?
« Reply #14 on: August 07, 2015, 03:13:20 AM »
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no, if he could destroy anything, it would be the solar system.

But imagine if this is only his 1st form, and he is like a Frieza... oooooooo tingly


i can imagine something even more further, if whiss and berus make a pottaro fusion, and became 1 god ?.

do you think that lord berus can destroy the very universe with just 1 blow?
« Reply #15 on: August 07, 2015, 10:26:42 AM »

    Offline Kiyza

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this was my point, we dont know the power of berus, because he only battle with ssjgod, and we dont know the power of ssjgod, because him only battle with berus, its kinda boring, and dc, marvel are there for a long time ago, i think that batman and superman are like 75-80 years too, the why we think that he can maybe destroy the universe, its because akira aways make a enemy 100x+ stronger than the previous, we have nothing yet, just our hope, the power level of divines in dc, marvel, its far away that a dbz character can doo,                                                                                                                                       


in this same chanel that make batman (with prepare) agaist goku, they also make berus vs saga (saint seya episode G), the problem here  is that this channel aways try to make dbz characters go down, they also aways says that maybe not even berus can fight in the light speed, i'm not a fanatic to say that a dbz character can go agaist a god from dc, marvel, but they are not this weak that some people think too.

Okay, so I'm not entirely sure what you're saying, but let me try to break this down.

I assume you're saying Goku's fight with Beerus was boring because... I don't know, they didn't blow up planets? It's not much better on the other side of the fence, y'know. Most western comic fight scenes are poorly choreographed, with good ones being the exception rather than the rule. I mean, I'd have trouble naming more than a few fights I really enjoyed. This is partially attributable to the fact that serialized American comics are usually 22 pages monthly and serialized Japanese ones are usually 14 to 18-ish pages weekly. Manga tends to be more decompressed and that leads to more room for fight scenes. More room means you can use a more "cinematic" style.

Next, yes, Batman and Superman are old too. Superman is 77 and Batman is 76. But let's try to move away from that and back to Dragon Ball. I don't want to write a short essay on why certain characters from Marvel and DC -- and not just superheroes/villains either -- are as powerful as they are. That's not what the thread is about (though that essay is something I plan to do in the future).

Anyway, continuing, I don't see any reason to assume that successive villains in Dragon Ball are literally hundreds of times stronger than the ones that came before, especially given that we know multipliers for Super Saiyan forms after the first one aren't especially impressive. Regardless, a lot of people tend to ignore simple physics when they use the "Character A is hundreds of times stronger than Character B, so he must be able to destroy *insert something absurd here*" argument, at least when it applies on a planetary scale or greater. Let me see if I can break this down, because the physics behind it are actually kind of interesting.

Space is big. Like, really, really big. Earth isn't even a little blue dot. You probably couldn't see it from a star over with the best instruments we currently have. The amount of energy needed to destroy a celestial body (be it planets, moons, stars, etc.) can be determined by the object's gravitational binding energy, the amount of force gravity is exerting to keep it together. It's a pretty ludicrous amount of energy -- something like the sun's entire energy output over weeks. The energy needed to destroy the sun is something like 42,000 times greater than the Earth because the sun is so big.

Consider, if you will, the Milky Way. It's about 100,000 light years across and contains more than 100 billion stars. Beats me how much energy it would take to destroy a galaxy, but anyone thinking it's easily conceivable to destroy the universe with an energy attack needs to know that there are more than 100 billion galaxies in the observable universe. No, not the whole universe, just the observable universe, and we don't really know how big the universe is.

I can hardly think of any characters that are even implied to be capable of doing something like that with an attack. I tried to mention it before, but characters who can destroy universes are generally the types who can also alter reality. The only one in the "destroy the universe with brute force" ballpark I can think of without some sort of reality alteration tacked is Krona (Green Lantern villain), and I’m actually not too sure about his powers, so again, please don’t quote me on this.

But I have to ask you, why do you want Beerus to be that powerful? Why do you even care? To win some silly Vs argument on the internet? It shouldn’t affect your enjoyment of a series. Why do you care about what some asshats on the internet say Goku or Beerus can or can’t beat? 


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do you think that lord berus can destroy the very universe with just 1 blow?
« Reply #16 on: August 07, 2015, 10:29:12 AM »
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do you think that lord berus can destroy the very universe with just 1 blow?
« Reply #17 on: August 07, 2015, 10:44:10 AM »
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Okay, so I'm not entirely sure what you're saying, but let me try to break this down.

I assume you're saying Goku's fight with Beerus was boring because... I don't know, they didn't blow up planets? It's not much better on the other side of the fence, y'know. Most western comic fight scenes are poorly choreographed, with good ones being the exception rather than the rule. I mean, I'd have trouble naming more than a few fights I really enjoyed. This is partially attributable to the fact that serialized American comics are usually 22 pages monthly and serialized Japanese ones are usually 14 to 18-ish pages weekly. Manga tends to be more decompressed and that leads to more room for fight scenes. More room means you can use a more "cinematic" style.

Next, yes, Batman and Superman are old too. Superman is 77 and Batman is 76. But let's try to move away from that and back to Dragon Ball. I don't want to write a short essay on why certain characters from Marvel and DC -- and not just superheroes/villains either -- are as powerful as they are. That's not what the thread is about (though that essay is something I plan to do in the future).

Anyway, continuing, I don't see any reason to assume that successive villains in Dragon Ball are literally hundreds of times stronger than the ones that came before, especially given that we know multipliers for Super Saiyan forms after the first one aren't especially impressive. Regardless, a lot of people tend to ignore simple physics when they use the "Character A is hundreds of times stronger than Character B, so he must be able to destroy *insert something absurd here*" argument, at least when it applies on a planetary scale or greater. Let me see if I can break this down, because the physics behind it are actually kind of interesting.

Space is big. Like, really, really big. Earth isn't even a little blue dot. You probably couldn't see it from a star over with the best instruments we currently have. The amount of energy needed to destroy a celestial body (be it planets, moons, stars, etc.) can be determined by the object's gravitational binding energy, the amount of force gravity is exerting to keep it together. It's a pretty ludicrous amount of energy -- something like the sun's entire energy output over weeks. The energy needed to destroy the sun is something like 42,000 times greater than the Earth because the sun is so big.

Consider, if you will, the Milky Way. It's about 100,000 light years across and contains more than 100 billion stars. Beats me how much energy it would take to destroy a galaxy, but anyone thinking it's easily conceivable to destroy the universe with an energy attack needs to know that there are more than 100 billion galaxies in the observable universe. No, not the whole universe, just the observable universe, and we don't really know how big the universe is.

I can hardly think of any characters that are even implied to be capable of doing something like that with an attack. I tried to mention it before, but characters who can destroy universes are generally the types who can also alter reality. The only one in the "destroy the universe with brute force" ballpark I can think of without some sort of reality alteration tacked is Krona (Green Lantern villain), and I’m actually not too sure about his powers, so again, please don’t quote me on this.

But I have to ask you, why do you want Beerus to be that powerful? Why do you even care? To win some silly Vs argument on the internet? It shouldn’t affect your enjoyment of a series. Why do you care about what some asshats on the internet say Goku or Beerus can or can’t beat? 


i just want to know  how  much powerful the people think that beerus is, i want to know how much akira get beeru's power impressed in each one's mind, what the people that see the movies feels when he came out, a overated think like ''wow he can destroy the universe'', or somethig oposite to that, like ''he can destroy a planet'', i want to know where beerus is placed in each one's mind, a god that can really destroy everything without limit of it, or something more like a solar system, or a galaxy,


to make it short, i just want to know how strong beerus is  for each one, regardless of his true power.

do you think that lord berus can destroy the very universe with just 1 blow?
« Reply #18 on: August 07, 2015, 11:35:55 AM »
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Nope but Superman Prime can.

do you think that lord berus can destroy the very universe with just 1 blow?
« Reply #19 on: August 07, 2015, 12:11:46 PM »
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here, i find a video that have evidences of how much beerus is strong