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Topic: The true downfall of Gaming. Why and when. What is going to happen to us?  (Read 5985 times)

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    Offline Umbrax

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"Several people tackle this topic on youtube with tons of great opinions.

Honestly you can start to see it.

Gaming never had uprise in the first place. It's not at it's peak and won't be for 2-3 years.

You can see that even the mighty Nintendo will have a downfall sooner or later.

The portable gaming industry will mostly be gone by the next 2 gaming generations.

The 3DS was a surprise success, and the Vita is barely at 2.5 million sold.

The Wii U is starting to get better and all and will most likely outsell the gamecube, but it's not doing too well by Nintendo's standards.

The Wii U is an amazing system, but they marketed it WAY wrong."


I wrote this on another topic, but somebody suggested I make this topic.

I believe it's the lack of communication between us and developers and also that we can't decide on anything, ever.





"Got told off by lukey senpai and made me wear the hat of shame for 5 months until he stopped looking at me with hate on his aussie eyes senpai dono sensei ggwp miyagi san naruto baka pokemon" - Our very own mature Moderator, West

The true downfall of Gaming. Why and when. What is going to happen to us?
« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2014, 07:47:15 AM »

    Offline Kiyza

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Let's break this down piece by piece.

"Several people tackle this topic on youtube with tons of great opinions.

I'd love to see a couple of them if you have time to dig them up and give us a link.

Honestly you can start to see it.

Gaming never had uprise in the first place. It's not at it's peak and won't be for 2-3 years.

Yes it did. While you can make the point that Tetris has still sold more copies than any modern video game to date, it's clear that gaming has changed a lot. The industry on the whole is valued in the tens of millions of dollars and we regularly see sales charts shattered by the bigger games selling almost as many copies as movies are selling tickets. Gaming on the whole has become much, much more mainstream these days with teens and adults being a much larger fraction of the market -- and they have more spending power than the kids who used to play them, which also affects the market. I you include phone games as a part of gaming (I mean, it is gaming, but it's not "core" gaming), then you really have to face the music and admit that what started out as a niche hobby for nerdy kids and teens and has become as normal as going to the movies and watching TV.

As for whether or not it's at its peak, we'll see what the market has to say. I think we'll hit a ceiling in the near future, but I think 2-3 years might be a bit soon. Also keep in mind that the mobile game market, which is very different from "core" gaming, is still just beginning to explode, even if "core" gaming seems to be reaching a peak.

You can see that even the mighty Nintendo will have a downfall sooner or later.

If you had said this a year or two ago, I would have been tempted to agree. Today, though, we're faced with the fact that 3DS sales in general are strong and the upcoming Wii U titles are not only looking enticing, they're also causing a serious bump in their console sales. I think that Microsoft will pull out of the console market long before Nintendo, and since their primary source of revenue does come from video games, Sony will probably die off before they do. They're dug in deep and it sees like they're just hitting a low period like they did with the Gamecube.

The portable gaming industry will mostly be gone by the next 2 gaming generations.

Portable gaming is bigger than ever thanks to tablets and smartphones. The idea of having a separate console specifically for portable gaming might not disappear entirely either, but I can see it becoming slightly more niche due to the inconvenience of having both your system and phone on hand if you're just using pockets instead of a bag. Still, if you can carry around a tablet with your phone, you can carry around a handheld system.

While it may seem like portable gaming is just going to migrate to tablets and smartphones, I ask you to consider this. The people who play handheld games on their cell phones are not the people who bring their 3DS around with them. While Nintendo's handhelds were initially aimed at a more casual crowd, they've started focusing, again, on the "core" market. Tablets and smartphones simply aren't designed for gaming in particular like a 3DS is -- they're meant to be multimedia devices. On top of that, the actual market for games on those devices consists mostly of shovelware and games about as complex as old arcade titles. It's not what hobbyist gamers want and demand from a portable system and it'll take quite a bit to change that, especially since consumers still gobble up titles like Candy Crush. With no reason to change marketing strategies, they'll probably continue down that path as long as they can.

The 3DS was a surprise success, and the Vita is barely at 2.5 million sold.

The Wii U is starting to get better and all and will most likely outsell the gamecube, but it's not doing too well by Nintendo's standards.

The Wii U is an amazing system, but they marketed it WAY wrong."

Like I said, the Wii U's sales are beginning to pick up now that they've got their killer apps both almost out and slated for 2015. (Smash 4 and Wii U Zelda respectively) That on top of a few rather tempting exclusives like Bayonetta and Hyrule Warriors have driven a lot of people over the edge recently.

Nintendo clearly can't return to the Wii's level of system sales for one reason. The Wii was successful not because it appealed to the core crowd, but because it got people who hadn't played video games to play video games. The DS also sold well for a lot of the same reasons. Even though they had their fair share of games meant to appeal to a core audience, the marketing was focused on getting new people to play games. Now, though, all of those people are migrating to tablets and smartphones, which I feel are going to have a big impact on gaming in the future, as they seem to have caused a very clear divide between the "casual" and "core" audiences.

However, Nintendo has decided to change their marketing strategy within the past year or so to begin focusing more on the "core" crowd, since they've acknowledged that they can't pull casuals away from their iPhones. So far, it seems like it's beginning to work well for them, if the Wii U sales spike and the overwhelmingly positive reaction to their panel at this year's E3 is anything to go by.


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The true downfall of Gaming. Why and when. What is going to happen to us?
« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2014, 08:11:56 AM »

    Offline Umbrax

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Let's break this down piece by piece.

I'd love to see a couple of them if you have time to dig them up and give us a link.

Yes it did. While you can make the point that Tetris has still sold more copies than any modern video game to date, it's clear that gaming has changed a lot. The industry on the whole is valued in the tens of millions of dollars and we regularly see sales charts shattered by the bigger games selling almost as many copies as movies are selling tickets. Gaming on the whole has become much, much more mainstream these days with teens and adults being a much larger fraction of the market -- and they have more spending power than the kids who used to play them, which also affects the market. I you include phone games as a part of gaming (I mean, it is gaming, but it's not "core" gaming), then you really have to face the music and admit that what started out as a niche hobby for nerdy kids and teens and has become as normal as going to the movies and watching TV.

As for whether or not it's at its peak, we'll see what the market has to say. I think we'll hit a ceiling in the near future, but I think 2-3 years might be a bit soon. Also keep in mind that the mobile game market, which is very different from "core" gaming, is still just beginning to explode, even if "core" gaming seems to be reaching a peak.

If you had said this a year or two ago, I would have been tempted to agree. Today, though, we're faced with the fact that 3DS sales in general are strong and the upcoming Wii U titles are not only looking enticing, they're also causing a serious bump in their console sales. I think that Microsoft will pull out of the console market long before Nintendo, and since their primary source of revenue does come from video games, Sony will probably die off before they do. They're dug in deep and it sees like they're just hitting a low period like they did with the Gamecube.

Portable gaming is bigger than ever thanks to tablets and smartphones. The idea of having a separate console specifically for portable gaming might not disappear entirely either, but I can see it becoming slightly more niche due to the inconvenience of having both your system and phone on hand if you're just using pockets instead of a bag. Still, if you can carry around a tablet with your phone, you can carry around a handheld system.

While it may seem like portable gaming is just going to migrate to tablets and smartphones, I ask you to consider this. The people who play handheld games on their cell phones are not the people who bring their 3DS around with them. While Nintendo's handhelds were initially aimed at a more casual crowd, they've started focusing, again, on the "core" market. Tablets and smartphones simply aren't designed for gaming in particular like a 3DS is -- they're meant to be multimedia devices. On top of that, the actual market for games on those devices consists mostly of shovelware and games about as complex as old arcade titles. It's not what hobbyist gamers want and demand from a portable system and it'll take quite a bit to change that, especially since consumers still gobble up titles like Candy Crush. With no reason to change marketing strategies, they'll probably continue down that path as long as they can.

Like I said, the Wii U's sales are beginning to pick up now that they've got their killer apps both almost out and slated for 2015. (Smash 4 and Wii U Zelda respectively) That on top of a few rather tempting exclusives like Bayonetta and Hyrule Warriors have driven a lot of people over the edge recently.

Nintendo clearly can't return to the Wii's level of system sales for one reason. The Wii was successful not because it appealed to the core crowd, but because it got people who hadn't played video games to play video games. The DS also sold well for a lot of the same reasons. Even though they had their fair share of games meant to appeal to a core audience, the marketing was focused on getting new people to play games. Now, though, all of those people are migrating to tablets and smartphones, which I feel are going to have a big impact on gaming in the future, as they seem to have caused a very clear divide between the "casual" and "core" audiences.

However, Nintendo has decided to change their marketing strategy within the past year or so to begin focusing more on the "core" crowd, since they've acknowledged that they can't pull casuals away from their iPhones. So far, it seems like it's beginning to work well for them, if the Wii U sales spike and the overwhelmingly positive reaction to their panel at this year's E3 is anything to go by.

I do not mean smart phones or anything like that.

I don't believe they will overtake us right now or in 10 years, and I think of the casuals as a different sort of player to begin with. I was raised to kinda believe that casuals will never happen with 2 older brothers. I am almost sort of bias against them because they will never experience what made gaming so good in the first place, you see.

That doesn't change the numbers, Kiyza. The 3DS was still a surprise success. The Vita (which is a good system) is still failing which dissapoints us all, but the numbers are the numbers.

What I mean't to say was that truely dedicated handhelds will go away before consoles do. I am starting to believe that to be true and within 15 years.

I think the big three will stay in for a good while longer, like a slug fest with rounds. Microsoft will go first, I think. If Sony drops the other electronic stuff and focus on the Playstation, they will be gold. I think the end will be just like the start. Nintendo Vs Se- I mean Sony for the 3D era atleast. (R.I.P. Dedicated Sega Consoles, we miss you  :'()

All I was saying was that 3 are starting to show signs of fatigue, like 3 people lifting up a bunch of weight. Who gives in first?

Though Nintendo will be last to go, it won't most likely be Nintendo's fault.

It's ours. The smartphones will eventually (like in 20 years) see console's heads get shot. The gaming industry will and can die.

I don't quite think we have hit our peak with consoles, but even the best fall down. (I mean look at Sega *single tear*)

The industry of gaming believe or not is still not as widespread as we think it is. In a lot of ways, we are still weak to the likes of movies and Television.

Last thing to say, I believe we will hit our peak in gaming once the older generations of people, (the skeptics) die out. There will be young and (stupid) parents in introducing their kids to videogames without the likes of the elders.

The industry as we know it is changing, and maybe a little too much.




"Got told off by lukey senpai and made me wear the hat of shame for 5 months until he stopped looking at me with hate on his aussie eyes senpai dono sensei ggwp miyagi san naruto baka pokemon" - Our very own mature Moderator, West

The true downfall of Gaming. Why and when. What is going to happen to us?
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2014, 08:22:09 AM »

    Offline Nia

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The way I see it, it's not so much gaming that's falling. It's gamers.

While many game companies and their franchises have fallen into complacency, there's just as many who strive to put out quality titles that actually are well-worth the investment.

But the real problem is the gamers.

"Oh, this one is too much like the last one."
"This one isn't enough like the last one."

They don't know how to take things with a grain of salt.

I loved Dragon Age: Origins. The sequel was perhaps over-simplified, but you know what? It was still a fantastic game. I loved it, too.
Incidentally, the third game, Inquisition, looks to combine some of the best stuff from the first two, and you know what? That strikes me as being great.
Inevitably though, a large amount of the players are just gonna whine and complain because the game isn't exactly what they wanted.

It was the same with Mass Effect. Lots of people hated the Mako in the first game (I myself wasn't a fan of it). Then in the sequel, people kept crying they wanted the Mako back. There's a DLC mission that came with a similar vehicle, and you know what happened? Those same people hated the stupid thing.
Does that one element ruin the entire game in either case? Nah.
I hate those missions. I especially hated the frail piece of junk in ME2. But it was far from a deal-breaker.

The gamers themselves are too schizophrenic.
There's certainly a lot of games that really are awful, and a lot of sequels that just were embarrassing.
There's a lot of sequels that are too similar, and a lot of sequels that aren't similar enough.
But you know what? It's been like that since even the early days.

Great game with a vastly different sequel: The Legend of Zelda. Yep, Zelda II was a huge departure from the original. But you know what? It's still a great game.

Great game with a nearly identical sequel: Megaman. Hell, even the X series was still basically the same. And guess what? It's a pretty solid series overall.


"I am the bone of my sword
 Steel is my body and fire is my blood
 I have created over a thousand blades
 Unknown to Death, Nor known to Life
 Have withstood pain to create many weapons
 Yet, those hands will never hold anything
 So as I pray, Unlimited Blade Works."

The true downfall of Gaming. Why and when. What is going to happen to us?
« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2014, 08:31:01 AM »

    Offline Jak

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The way I see it, it's not so much gaming that's falling. It's gamers.

While many game companies and their franchises have fallen into complacency, there's just as many who strive to put out quality titles that actually are well-worth the investment.

But the real problem is the gamers.

"Oh, this one is too much like the last one."
"This one isn't enough like the last one."

They don't know how to take things with a grain of salt.

I loved Dragon Age: Origins. The sequel was perhaps over-simplified, but you know what? It was still a fantastic game. I loved it, too.
Incidentally, the third game, Inquisition, looks to combine some of the best stuff from the first two, and you know what? That strikes me as being great.
Inevitably though, a large amount of the players are just gonna whine and complain because the game isn't exactly what they wanted.

It was the same with Mass Effect. Lots of people hated the Mako in the first game (I myself wasn't a fan of it). Then in the sequel, people kept crying they wanted the Mako back. There's a DLC mission that came with a similar vehicle, and you know what happened? Those same people hated the stupid thing.
Does that one element ruin the entire game in either case? Nah.
I hate those missions. I especially hated the frail piece of junk in ME2. But it was far from a deal-breaker.

The gamers themselves are too schizophrenic.
There's certainly a lot of games that really are awful, and a lot of sequels that just were embarrassing.
There's a lot of sequels that are too similar, and a lot of sequels that aren't similar enough.
But you know what? It's been like that since even the early days.

Great game with a vastly different sequel: The Legend of Zelda. Yep, Zelda II was a huge departure from the original. But you know what? It's still a great game.

Great game with a nearly identical sequel: Megaman. Hell, even the X series was still basically the same. And guess what? It's a pretty solid series overall.

Gamers say they want innovation but when the developers give it to them they turn their nose up at it. Games in many franchises that deviated from the formula were often heralded as one of the best in the franchise but ended up with some of the worst sales number.

Yes Nia, I know what you just said and what I just said are basically the same, but you ramble too much.

The true downfall of Gaming. Why and when. What is going to happen to us?
« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2014, 08:33:39 AM »

    Offline Nia

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Gamers say they want innovation but when the developers give it to them they turn their nose up at it. Games in many franchises that deviated from the formula were often heralded as one of the best in the franchise but ended up with some of the worst sales number.

Yes Nia, I know what you just said and what I just said are basically the same, but you ramble too much.

It's called style.


"I am the bone of my sword
 Steel is my body and fire is my blood
 I have created over a thousand blades
 Unknown to Death, Nor known to Life
 Have withstood pain to create many weapons
 Yet, those hands will never hold anything
 So as I pray, Unlimited Blade Works."

The true downfall of Gaming. Why and when. What is going to happen to us?
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2014, 08:34:02 AM »

    Offline Umbrax

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The way I see it, it's not so much gaming that's falling. It's gamers.

While many game companies and their franchises have fallen into complacency, there's just as many who strive to put out quality titles that actually are well-worth the investment.

But the real problem is the gamers.

"Oh, this one is too much like the last one."
"This one isn't enough like the last one."

They don't know how to take things with a grain of salt.

I loved Dragon Age: Origins. The sequel was perhaps over-simplified, but you know what? It was still a fantastic game. I loved it, too.
Incidentally, the third game, Inquisition, looks to combine some of the best stuff from the first two, and you know what? That strikes me as being great.
Inevitably though, a large amount of the players are just gonna whine and complain because the game isn't exactly what they wanted.

It was the same with Mass Effect. Lots of people hated the Mako in the first game (I myself wasn't a fan of it). Then in the sequel, people kept crying they wanted the Mako back. There's a DLC mission that came with a similar vehicle, and you know what happened? Those same people hated the stupid thing.
Does that one element ruin the entire game in either case? Nah.
I hate those missions. I especially hated the frail piece of junk in ME2. But it was far from a deal-breaker.

The gamers themselves are too schizophrenic.
There's certainly a lot of games that really are awful, and a lot of sequels that just were embarrassing.
There's a lot of sequels that are too similar, and a lot of sequels that aren't similar enough.
But you know what? It's been like that since even the early days.

Great game with a vastly different sequel: The Legend of Zelda. Yep, Zelda II was a huge departure from the original. But you know what? It's still a great game.

Great game with a nearly identical sequel: Megaman. Hell, even the X series was still basically the same. And guess what? It's a pretty solid series overall.


That's what I was saying the whole time. It's our fault. We can never come together as a community. We are not like other media where in movies, people like what they like and they won't be harassed.

That's why gaming will never be a true media.

Take what i'm saying with a grain of salt, won't ya?




"Got told off by lukey senpai and made me wear the hat of shame for 5 months until he stopped looking at me with hate on his aussie eyes senpai dono sensei ggwp miyagi san naruto baka pokemon" - Our very own mature Moderator, West

The true downfall of Gaming. Why and when. What is going to happen to us?
« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2014, 08:41:31 AM »

    Offline Jak

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What I find to be the biggest cancer to gaming is this religion called fanboyism.

They worship the plastic box they bought, believe the company that made it can do no wrong and don't hold them accountable for naughtyword-ups, act venomously towards anyone with a differing opinion and, regardless of shitty business practices, take any game presented to them with their ass cheeks spread and ready for naughtyword. No concept of voting with their wallets.

The true downfall of Gaming. Why and when. What is going to happen to us?
« Reply #8 on: November 07, 2014, 08:53:04 AM »

    Offline Kiyza

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I do not mean smart phones or anything like that.

I don't believe they will overtake us right now or in 10 years, and I think of the casuals as a different sort of player to begin with. I was raised to kinda believe that casuals will never happen with 2 older brothers. I am almost sort of bias against them because they will never experience what made gaming so good in the first place, you see.

I'm not really sure what you're trying to say here. Could you clarify it?

That doesn't change the numbers, Kiyza. The 3DS was still a surprise success. The Vita (which is a good system) is still failing which dissapoints us all, but the numbers are the numbers.

Yes, being a success doesn't change the numbers. The fact of the matter is, the 3DS is still in good shape. I fail to see how handheld systems are a dying breed when I get four to six Streetpasses in a day at a small community college and everyone in the lunchroom plays Smash Bros. together at noon. If handheld gamers are a dying breed, why are there so many young people who enjoy it?

What I mean't to say was that truely dedicated handhelds will go away before consoles do. I am starting to believe that to be true and within 15 years.

I don't think we can predict such a radical change so far away, especially when current market conditions suggest that there's still very much a place for handheld systems. The Vita failed due to a lack of tempting games (especially the ever-crucial killer app) and effective absence of marketing. If handheld games go away, they'd need something to replace them, as people who enjoy handheld games won't magically disappear in 15 years. People like me who play 3DS games now are still going to want to have a good gaming experience on the go in the future, especially since people don't seem to magically grow out of video games. Though they may spend less time on them due to things like work, once a gamer is always a gamer in my experience.

I think the big three will stay in for a good while longer, like a slug fest with rounds. Microsoft will go first, I think. If Sony drops the other electronic stuff and focus on the Playstation, they will be gold. I think the end will be just like the start. Nintendo Vs Se- I mean Sony for the 3D era atleast. (R.I.P. Dedicated Sega Consoles, we miss you  :'()

All I was saying was that 3 are starting to show signs of fatigue, like 3 people lifting up a bunch of weight. Who gives in first?

I think that Microsoft will likely pull out by the end of this generation due to the Xbox One's lackluster sales. As almost every game is shared between the PS4 and Xbox One and most of the well-received exclusives on the former, I don't see there being anything to increase the console's sales and pull it out of the rut. If no one buys the hardware, they're not going to play the software.

Though Nintendo will be last to go, it won't most likely be Nintendo's fault.

It's ours. The smartphones will eventually (like in 20 years) see console's heads get shot. The gaming industry will and can die.

I don't quite think we have hit our peak with consoles, but even the best fall down. (I mean look at Sega *single tear*)

I don't think you get what I'm saying. People who play video games on smartphones are not the same market as people who play them on a home console, PC, or handheld system. A smartphone can't replace console gaming because it doesn't offer the type of experience the console gamer has come to crave. It doesn't have buttons and can only use touch controls, the display is small, the graphics will always be at a low resolution, the majority of games can't be sold for more than pennies on the dollar and as a result, the high-cost, high-payoff games developed today couldn't be made for such a market -- yet there's still an enormous demand for them.

I think what's more a threat to console gaming is the prevalence of PC gaming. Most games available for the Xbox One and PS4 are also available on a computer, and more and more people are getting into computer games due to the fact that it's becoming much more convenient through things like Steam. More and more of the core audience is gravitating toward it and a PC can basically do everything the PS4 and Xbox One can and more. Those are the same people who used to be a part of the console market, not a separate group of people who don't play core games.

To say that consoles will die out because smartphones exist is like saying that movie theaters will die out because I Netflix everything.

The industry of gaming believe or not is still not as widespread as we think it is. In a lot of ways, we are still weak to the likes of movies and Television.

It's the largest entertainment industry if we're going by sales. $63 billion a year beats out both movies and pornography. Granted, games probably make more money per sale than, say, movie tickets, but it's still a mainstream hobby.

Last thing to say, I believe we will hit our peak in gaming once the older generations of people, (the skeptics) die out. There will be young and (stupid) parents in introducing their kids to videogames without the likes of the elders.

The industry as we know it is changing, and maybe a little too much.

Eh, I think by that point, playing video games will probably be as widespread as movies and TV shows. Like them, we'll also probably have a split between people who just flip channels (casuals) and people who watch their favorite shows compulsively. (hobbyists)

The way I see it, it's not so much gaming that's falling. It's gamers.

While many game companies and their franchises have fallen into complacency, there's just as many who strive to put out quality titles that actually are well-worth the investment.

But the real problem is the gamers.

"Oh, this one is too much like the last one."
"This one isn't enough like the last one."

They don't know how to take things with a grain of salt.

But they're kind of right about that in some aspects. When something is a part of a series, you expect it feel like the same thing in some aspects, but not be an utter carbon copy.

Either way, gamers are not the only ones who have to put up with that or buy into it. Moviegoers suffer from the exact same thing, yet repetitive movie sequels still do well -- up to a certain point.


That's what I was saying the whole time. It's our fault. We can never come together as a community. We are not like other media where in movies, people like what they like and they won't be harassed.

That's why gaming will never be a true media.

Take what i'm saying with a grain of salt, won't ya?

No it's not. People who watch movies and TV shows don't "come together as a community". Literally the only medium where I've seen that kind of mentality -- for almost the entire medium -- is comics, and that's because it's so niche.

People get harassed and bitched at in every "community". Do you think moviegoers don't tear one another apart over what blockbusters they preferred? Asking for people to stop chewing one another out over their tastes is asking for a miracle. It's always going to happen.

What I find to be the biggest cancer to gaming is this religion called fanboyism.

They worship the plastic box they bought, believe the company that made it can do no wrong and don't hold them accountable for naughtyword-ups, act venomously towards anyone with a differing opinion and, regardless of shitty business practices, take any game presented to them with their ass cheeks spread and ready for naughtyword. No concept of voting with their wallets.

The companies themselves kind of promote this mentality, though. While I do "vote with my wallet", there's not enough in my wallet to vote with if I want to buy a PS4 exclusive because guess what? I don't have a PS4. Naturally, I'm not going to buy that PS4 exclusive, as that would be an investment of several hundred dollars that I don't have. Sure I could save the money, but why would I do that when all of these great games for my PC and 3DS are coming out and I want those too?

Notice that this type of fanboy mentality almost always comes into play when you're dealing with the companies that make consoles. While you have people constantly arguing about Nintendo Vs Sony Vs Microsoft, very few people express that kind of fanboyism when it comes to developers and smaller publishers. The very nature of video game consoles creates this kind of mentality and I think it's unfair to blame it on the customers. It's not like comic book fans where the only people they can blame for Marvel Vs DC shitflinging is themselves.


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« Reply #9 on: November 07, 2014, 08:54:55 AM »

    Offline Umbrax

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What I find to be the biggest cancer to gaming is this religion called fanboyism.

They worship the plastic box they bought, believe the company that made it can do no wrong and don't hold them accountable for *-ups, act venomously towards anyone with a differing opinion and, regardless of shitty business practices, take any game presented to them with their ass cheeks spread and ready for *. No concept of voting with their wallets.

Fanboys are always there and always will be.

Personally I like all consoles and crud.

But when you think about it, sometimes fanboyism can be a good thing.

Lots of Nintendo games wouldn't have been made with out the fanboys pushing.

HECK MM3D was solely created because everybody pushed Miyamoto and his heavenly *snicker* crew to make it.

That's a surface level answer, Jak, and you know it. Fanboyism might be a huge problem but..

That is not the true problem that is killing our industry. I think the freedom of opinion and letting more diverse groups play videogames is what is killing it. Ironically, the thing that is helping it now, will kill it.

I think we should be more secluded, because that is what protects us. With freedom, comes corruption and (sometimes good) opinions. Many people will judge videogames because they are allowed too now, and they don't even play them. You see countless parents buying their kid COD, but then blame the industry for it.

It's blind hatred that will kill us.

You can almost say videogames were doomed from the start.

Remember, with any remotely new media, there will be hatred. Look at the comics in the 40's. Countless radiostars interviewing children and parents alike on how "evil" comic books are.

Now Disney owns Marvel, and comic just actually became mainstream in 2008 with Iron Man.




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« Reply #10 on: November 07, 2014, 08:57:27 AM »

    Offline Nia

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Now I have an excuse to post this:



Dragon Age II perfectly fits in with this. XD


"I am the bone of my sword
 Steel is my body and fire is my blood
 I have created over a thousand blades
 Unknown to Death, Nor known to Life
 Have withstood pain to create many weapons
 Yet, those hands will never hold anything
 So as I pray, Unlimited Blade Works."

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« Reply #11 on: November 07, 2014, 09:03:37 AM »

    Offline Vroku

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Microsoft now own's Minecraft, endless opportunities.

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« Reply #12 on: November 07, 2014, 09:06:08 AM »

    Offline Nia

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Nintendo is crap, Sony is shit, Microsoft is a huge turd, indie gaming is a joke, online games are the scourge of mankind.

Prove me wrong.


Done.

(Although, it should be noted that WKC2's servers were shut down last year :x)


"I am the bone of my sword
 Steel is my body and fire is my blood
 I have created over a thousand blades
 Unknown to Death, Nor known to Life
 Have withstood pain to create many weapons
 Yet, those hands will never hold anything
 So as I pray, Unlimited Blade Works."

The true downfall of Gaming. Why and when. What is going to happen to us?
« Reply #13 on: November 07, 2014, 09:07:41 AM »

    Offline Umbrax

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I'm not really sure what you're trying to say here. Could you clarify it?

Yes, being a success doesn't change the numbers. The fact of the matter is, the 3DS is still in good shape. I fail to see how handheld systems are a dying breed when I get four to six Streetpasses in a day at a small community college and everyone in the lunchroom plays Smash Bros. together at noon. If handheld gamers are a dying breed, why are there so many young people who enjoy it?

I don't think we can predict such a radical change so far away, especially when current market conditions suggest that there's still very much a place for handheld systems. The Vita failed due to a lack of tempting games (especially the ever-crucial killer app) and effective absence of marketing. If handheld games go away, they'd need something to replace them, as people who enjoy handheld games won't magically disappear in 15 years. People like me who play 3DS games now are still going to want to have a good gaming experience on the go in the future, especially since people don't seem to magically grow out of video games. Though they may spend less time on them due to things like work, once a gamer is always a gamer in my experience.

I think that Microsoft will likely pull out by the end of this generation due to the Xbox One's lackluster sales. As almost every game is shared between the PS4 and Xbox One and most of the well-received exclusives on the former, I don't see there being anything to increase the console's sales and pull it out of the rut. If no one buys the hardware, they're not going to play the software.

I don't think you get what I'm saying. People who play video games on smartphones are not the same market as people who play them on a home console, PC, or handheld system. A smartphone can't replace console gaming because it doesn't offer the type of experience the console gamer has come to crave. It doesn't have buttons and can only use touch controls, the display is small, the graphics will always be at a low resolution, the majority of games can't be sold for more than pennies on the dollar and as a result, the high-cost, high-payoff games developed today couldn't be made for such a market -- yet there's still an enormous demand for them.

I think what's more a threat to console gaming is the prevalence of PC gaming. Most games available for the Xbox One and PS4 are also available on a computer, and more and more people are getting into computer games due to the fact that it's becoming much more convenient through things like Steam. More and more of the core audience is gravitating toward it and a PC can basically do everything the PS4 and Xbox One can and more. Those are the same people who used to be a part of the console market, not a separate group of people who don't play core games.

To say that consoles will die out because smartphones exist is like saying that movie theaters will die out because I Netflix everything.

It's the largest entertainment industry if we're going by sales. $63 billion a year beats out both movies and pornography. Granted, games probably make more money per sale than, say, movie tickets, but it's still a mainstream hobby.

Eh, I think by that point, playing video games will probably be as widespread as movies and TV shows. Like them, we'll also probably have a split between people who just flip channels (casuals) and people who watch their favorite shows compulsively. (hobbyists)

But they're kind of right about that in some aspects. When something is a part of a series, you expect it feel like the same thing in some aspects, but not be an utter carbon copy.

Either way, gamers are not the only ones who have to put up with that or buy into it. Moviegoers suffer from the exact same thing, yet repetitive movie sequels still do well -- up to a certain point.

No it's not. People who watch movies and TV shows don't "come together as a community". Literally the only medium where I've seen that kind of mentality -- for almost the entire medium -- is comics, and that's because it's so niche.

People get harassed and bitched at in every "community". Do you think moviegoers don't tear one another apart over what blockbusters they preferred? Asking for people to stop chewing one another out over their tastes is asking for a miracle. It's always going to happen.

The companies themselves kind of promote this mentality, though. While I do "vote with my wallet", there's not enough in my wallet to vote with if I want to buy a PS4 exclusive because guess what? I don't have a PS4. Naturally, I'm not going to buy that PS4 exclusive, as that would be an investment of several hundred dollars that I don't have. Sure I could save the money, but why would I do that when all of these great games for my PC and 3DS are coming out and I want those too?

Notice that this type of fanboy mentality almost always comes into play when you're dealing with the companies that make consoles. While you have people constantly arguing about Nintendo Vs Sony Vs Microsoft, very few people express that kind of fanboyism when it comes to developers and smaller publishers. The very nature of video game consoles creates this kind of mentality and I think it's unfair to blame it on the customers. It's not like comic book fans where the only people they can blame for Marvel Vs DC shitflinging is themselves.

I don't quite think you see what i'm saying. Actual gaming isn't quite mainstream yet, you see. The older generations still mock us and say that Video Games isnt a "true media". You don't see any doubters of movies being a true media at all. We have not come to the point where not one person mocks video games, and most people 30+ do.

There is this mentality, this mind set that gamers sit in there house all day in the basement playing video games. That's sterotype is still widespread.

I have a lot of friends who don't know who Mario is, and that is sad.




"Got told off by lukey senpai and made me wear the hat of shame for 5 months until he stopped looking at me with hate on his aussie eyes senpai dono sensei ggwp miyagi san naruto baka pokemon" - Our very own mature Moderator, West

The true downfall of Gaming. Why and when. What is going to happen to us?
« Reply #14 on: November 07, 2014, 09:10:11 AM »

    Offline GogetaAR

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« Reply #15 on: November 07, 2014, 09:10:32 AM »

    Offline SSJGGoku

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« Reply #16 on: November 07, 2014, 09:11:29 AM »

    Offline Nia

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Lmao, thanks for proving me correct, Nia-senpai~<3

Doesn't change the fact that it was an incredible 1st party title from Sony, and that it actually still can be played... just not online.

Well someone's going to have to "Finish The Fight."- Halo reference.

Not Microsoft.
You know why it's called the X-Box One, right?
...Because that's the number of non-first person shooter ganes the console is gonna get. XD


"I am the bone of my sword
 Steel is my body and fire is my blood
 I have created over a thousand blades
 Unknown to Death, Nor known to Life
 Have withstood pain to create many weapons
 Yet, those hands will never hold anything
 So as I pray, Unlimited Blade Works."

The true downfall of Gaming. Why and when. What is going to happen to us?
« Reply #17 on: November 07, 2014, 09:13:39 AM »

    Offline Jak

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Nintendo is crap, Sony is shit, Microsoft is a huge turd, indie gaming is a joke, online games are the scourge of mankind.

Prove me wrong.

ET is the best game ever. Prove me wrong.

Fanboys are always there and always will be.

Personally I like all consoles and crud.

But when you think about it, sometimes fanboyism can be a good thing.

Lots of Nintendo games wouldn't have been made with out the fanboys pushing.

HECK MM3D was solely created because everybody pushed Miyamoto and his heavenly *snicker* crew to make it.

That's a surface level answer, Jak, and you know it. Fanboyism might be a huge problem but..

That is not the true problem that is killing our industry. I think the freedom of opinion and letting more diverse groups play videogames is what is killing it. Ironically, the thing that is helping it now, will kill it.

I think we should be more secluded, because that is what protects us. With freedom, comes corruption and (sometimes good) opinions. Many people will judge videogames because they are allowed too now, and they don't even play them. You see countless parents buying their kid COD, but then blame the industry for it.

It's blind hatred that will kill us.

You can almost say videogames were doomed from the start.

Remember, with any remotely new media, there will be hatred. Look at the comics in the 40's. Countless radiostars interviewing children and parents alike on how "evil" comic books are.

Now Disney owns Marvel, and comic just actually became mainstream in 2008 with Iron Man.

If you want to call my opinion a surface-level answer that's fine, but what you presented as an alternative sounds absolutely horrid. It sounds to me as if it would further divide the community and inhibit our ability to communicate with companies in large numbers. That can only be a detriment.

And just to clarify, I called fanboys the biggest cancer, not the only answer. There are many other issues worth addressing, I simply hold the opinion the fanboys are the biggest problem. This is a multifaceted issue and you aren't going to find a solution attacking only one thing any more than you can kill someone by stabbing their thumb.

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« Reply #18 on: November 07, 2014, 09:14:50 AM »

    Offline SSJGGoku

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Not Microsoft.
I know I just wanted to make that reference. I had my best gaming times on Xbox, but i think Nintendo will last the longest.

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« Reply #19 on: November 07, 2014, 09:19:01 AM »

    Offline Nia

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Okay, fine...
It still is an incredible title.

People and their attempts to take things out of context and change the meaning of what someone else was saying...


"I am the bone of my sword
 Steel is my body and fire is my blood
 I have created over a thousand blades
 Unknown to Death, Nor known to Life
 Have withstood pain to create many weapons
 Yet, those hands will never hold anything
 So as I pray, Unlimited Blade Works."

The true downfall of Gaming. Why and when. What is going to happen to us?
« Reply #20 on: November 07, 2014, 09:19:15 AM »

    Offline Kiyza

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Remember, with any remotely new media, there will be hatred. Look at the comics in the 40's. Countless radiostars interviewing children and parents alike on how "evil" comic books are.

Now Disney owns Marvel, and comic just actually became mainstream in 2008 with Iron Man.

What? Comics are not mainstream, at least not in the United States (and Canada). Not when selling 30,000 issues of your comic is considered selling well and around 10 million single issues are sold annually in the US. In the entire industry. Even if you assumed that everyone only bought a single monthly series (most people buy anywhere from 5 to 20 in my experience), there would be less than a million people in America actually reading comics. In reality, it's far less.

Comics aren't mainstream. Superhero films are mainstream. There's a difference.

I think we should be more secluded, because that is what protects us. With freedom, comes corruption and (sometimes good) opinions. Many people will judge videogames because they are allowed too now, and they don't even play them. You see countless parents buying their kid COD, but then blame the industry for it.

I need to address this second because I need my background as a comic book fan to do so.

Having video games become secluded will literally kill the industry. While great comics are possible to produce regardless of the money put into it, that's because it's a passion project. Games kind of need the amount of money put into their development they're getting in order to push the limits of what they can do. Game development is expensive, paying artists and writers isn't.

Comics are free of the prying eyes of parents now, but at what cost? We still have loads and loads of infighting, people still buy a lot of shitty comics without a second thought about it, and the worst part is, the only new opinions we get are from social justice warriors attempting to co-opt the hobby -- which they've basically already done to an extent.

No. We gamers should be happy that our medium is mainstream. Seclusion isn't a good thing.

I don't quite think you see what i'm saying. Actual gaming isn't quite mainstream yet, you see. The older generations still mock us and say that Video Games isnt a "true media". You don't see any doubters of movies being a true media at all. We have not come to the point where not one person mocks video games, and most people 30+ do.

There is this mentality, this mind set that gamers sit in there house all day in the basement playing video games. That's sterotype is still widespread.

I have a lot of friends who don't know who Mario is, and that is sad.

They can cry all they want, but they can't change two very important facts.

1. The latest Grand Theft Auto title sold 34 million copies internationally. That's the equivalent of a tenth of the United States' population purchasing it, and it's a core game.

2. Video games are legally recognized as an art form by the American Supreme Court. There's no way for older generations to impose a lot of legal restrictions on them because of that status. They can keep their kids from playing them, but they have no say in the fate of games.

Again, I'm going to bring up comics. While great, artistic comics were beginning to come out as early as the late '60s, it wasn't until well after comics like Watchmen and The Dark Knight returns -- both titles from the mid '80s, that comics started to be accepted as a form of art. These days, very few people will doubt their legitimacy as an artistic medium, but it took decades to get that point. (again, in America -- countries like France and Japan haven't had the same issues due to cultural differences)

Comics in their modern incarnation started in the early 1900s. Video games started around the 1960s. It'll get there eventually.


3DS Friend Code: 2750-1102-6000
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« Reply #21 on: November 07, 2014, 09:20:20 AM »

    Offline Umbrax

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ET is the best game ever. Prove me wrong.

If you want to call my opinion a surface-level answer that's fine, but what you presented as an alternative sounds absolutely horrid. It sounds to me as if it would further divide the community and inhibit our ability to communicate with companies in large numbers. That can only be a detriment.

And just to clarify, I called fanboys the biggest cancer, not the only answer. There are many other issues worth addressing, I simply hold the opinion the fanboys are the biggest problem. This is a multifaceted issue and you aren't going to find a solution attacking only one thing any more than you can kill someone by stabbing their thumb.

I don't mean VERY VERY Secluded, I just mean separate Casual Gamers from us.

We should be split like that. They don't add anything to us, and we don't add anything to them.





"Got told off by lukey senpai and made me wear the hat of shame for 5 months until he stopped looking at me with hate on his aussie eyes senpai dono sensei ggwp miyagi san naruto baka pokemon" - Our very own mature Moderator, West

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« Reply #22 on: November 07, 2014, 09:26:02 AM »

    Offline Umbrax

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What? Comics are not mainstream, at least not in the United States (and Canada). Not when selling 30,000 issues of your comic is considered selling well and around 10 million single issues are sold annually in the US. In the entire industry. Even if you assumed that everyone only bought a single monthly series (most people buy anywhere from 5 to 20 in my experience), there would be less than a million people in America actually reading comics. In reality, it's far less.

Comics aren't mainstream. Superhero films are mainstream. There's a difference.

I need to address this second because I need my background as a comic book fan to do so.

Having video games become secluded will literally kill the industry. While great comics are possible to produce regardless of the money put into it, that's because it's a passion project. Games kind of need the amount of money put into their development they're getting in order to push the limits of what they can do. Game development is expensive, paying artists and writers isn't.

Comics are free of the prying eyes of parents now, but at what cost? We still have loads and loads of infighting, people still buy a lot of shitty comics without a second thought about it, and the worst part is, the only new opinions we get are from social justice warriors attempting to co-opt the hobby -- which they've basically already done to an extent.

No. We gamers should be happy that our medium is mainstream. Seclusion isn't a good thing.

They can cry all they want, but they can't change two very important facts.

1. The latest Grand Theft Auto title sold 34 million copies internationally. That's the equivalent of a tenth of the United States' population purchasing it, and it's a core game.

2. Video games are legally recognized as an art form by the American Supreme Court. There's no way for older generations to impose a lot of legal restrictions on them because of that status. They can keep their kids from playing them, but they have no say in the fate of games.

Again, I'm going to bring up comics. While great, artistic comics were beginning to come out as early as the late '60s, it wasn't until well after comics like Watchmen and The Dark Knight returns -- both titles from the mid '80s, that comics started to be accepted as a form of art. These days, very few people will doubt their legitimacy as an artistic medium, but it took decades to get that point. (again, in America -- countries like France and Japan haven't had the same issues due to cultural differences)

Comics in their modern incarnation started in the early 1900s. Video games started around the 1960s. It'll get there eventually.

Answered secluded thing with Jak. I don't actually mean split us apart. I mean have someone differentiate IOS from consoles.

What i'm trying to say is, that, if videogames aren't universally accepted as media, it will never be like movies.

The stories that DC and Marvel are mainstream in their own right. More and more people are starting to be interested in it.

Sorry for the consfusion.





"Got told off by lukey senpai and made me wear the hat of shame for 5 months until he stopped looking at me with hate on his aussie eyes senpai dono sensei ggwp miyagi san naruto baka pokemon" - Our very own mature Moderator, West

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« Reply #23 on: November 07, 2014, 09:26:29 AM »

    Offline Nia

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Nia, what I'm saying is, the games OF TODAY are absolute rubbish. Not every game that has ever been made. That's why I used "is" in my first post.

WKC2 isn't that old. It came out just a few years ago.

There's plenty of good games coming out. I think you're just playing the wrong ones.


"I am the bone of my sword
 Steel is my body and fire is my blood
 I have created over a thousand blades
 Unknown to Death, Nor known to Life
 Have withstood pain to create many weapons
 Yet, those hands will never hold anything
 So as I pray, Unlimited Blade Works."

The true downfall of Gaming. Why and when. What is going to happen to us?
« Reply #24 on: November 07, 2014, 09:29:36 AM »

    Offline Umbrax

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WKC2 isn't that old. It came out just a few years ago.

There's plenty of good games coming out. I think you're just playing the wrong ones.

Tons and Tons.

My new favorite indie game is Steamworld Dig for right now.

Actually, Sunset overdrive looks pretty decent.

cant wait when they port it to the pc




"Got told off by lukey senpai and made me wear the hat of shame for 5 months until he stopped looking at me with hate on his aussie eyes senpai dono sensei ggwp miyagi san naruto baka pokemon" - Our very own mature Moderator, West