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Topic: SSJ Usefulness  (Read 8252 times)

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SSJ Usefulness
« on: September 09, 2014, 06:25:11 AM »

    Offline LordSchmee

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Hey guys,
I admit I never played the game, so I can't really say from experience, but I've seen a lot of people say that SSJ in DBO is actually less useful than Kaio-ken in like... almost every way.

If that's true, do you think it'd be possible to upgrade the ability (and perhaps the GN/PM if they're similarly afflicted) for the release of DBOR?

I don't mean to make it SUPER OP (although that's basically the point of SSJ, especially if there's a short time limit), but at least making it twice as useful as KK or so, to make it worth hunting for the Dragonballs to get it?

I don't know, other than the cool transformation ability, I don't seem to see much reason to waste your wish on SSJ (from all the feedback I've seen). Would be better served getting the HTB skill or some equipment?

SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #1 on: September 09, 2014, 06:27:58 AM »
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As a person who has played official DBO it would be great to get a better ssj.

SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #2 on: September 09, 2014, 06:37:55 AM »
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In my opinion SSJ would be worth to wish for if it would be available with lvl 50 again...like in the good old lvl 55 cap...but then some noobs be like: "Oh ma gaawwwd NOOOOO! I wanna be op ssj with lvl 40!" ....
*click for original size*

SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #3 on: September 09, 2014, 06:42:32 AM »

    Offline Spark

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Hey guys,
I admit I never played the game, so I can't really say from experience, but I've seen a lot of people say that SSJ in DBO is actually less useful than Kaio-ken in like... almost every way.

If that's true, do you think it'd be possible to upgrade the ability (and perhaps the GN/PM if they're similarly afflicted) for the release of DBOR?

I don't mean to make it SUPER OP (although that's basically the point of SSJ, especially if there's a short time limit), but at least making it twice as useful as KK or so, to make it worth hunting for the Dragonballs to get it?

I don't know, other than the cool transformation ability, I don't seem to see much reason to waste your wish on SSJ (from all the feedback I've seen). Would be better served getting the HTB skill or some equipment?
Its not useless imo, it just depends on the situation.


Poof

SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #4 on: September 09, 2014, 06:45:55 AM »

    Offline LordSchmee

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I personally don't see the point in capping it - if someone makes the wish at lv40, or 30, then lucky them for getting the Dragonballs. But I think 40's a decent cap. Actually I think it should be reduced for DBOR (since the initial level cap might only be 38 to start with), so reduced to 35 or 38 would make more sense.

However that's not the issue so I won't discuss it in this thread any further (although I wouldn't mind discussing it in a different thread if one was made).

The fact that SSJ is on par with (or apparently less useful than) a vanilla ability seems pretty shocking. SSJ's supposed to be FAR superior to KK in the series. And while I get that there has to be some balancing done to make it more fair in-game, making it less useful even though it's a Dragonball wish seems rather pointless. From what I've gathered, there's essentially no reason to wish for SSJ aside from cosmetic issues. It should, at the very least, be twice as powerful as Kaio-ken, although I personally think it should be a bit more than that (especially if it's got such a short timer anyway, it'd make it more like the series and less like an MMO - a short burst of supreme power to get you out of a sticky situation).

(Also, I never said it was exceptionally pointless. It has its own small share of uses, true, but no where near enough to warrant wasting a Dragonball wish on. You'd be much better off maxing out Kaio-ken instead.

SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #5 on: September 09, 2014, 06:48:27 AM »

    Offline Iceman

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Its not useless imo, it just depends on the situation.

Yeah I agree. You people need to understand that even if you have fighter with high dex and dodge and going in SSJ won't make you dodge everything 100% lol.

Yeah you will dodge skills based on hit rate but skill based on success rate will hit you.
SSJ - x2 EP , more power, more critic, more speed but EP drain exist.

It is better than kaioken because you can handle it longer.

Kaioken on other hand is good for short time, good dmg/speed but it drain you LP and EP.
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SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #6 on: September 09, 2014, 06:49:16 AM »

    Offline Xicer

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Sorry but if you never played the game then I don't think you should be making suggestions on how to change things.
KoK and ssj both had their uses, kok being better for pve and ssj being better for pvp.

SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2014, 06:53:34 AM »
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The fact that SSJ is on par with (or apparently less useful than) a vanilla ability seems pretty shocking. SSJ's supposed to be FAR superior to KK in the series.

Yes...in the series ...this is not the series...this is the Future in which Humans have a bit of the DNA from Goku and Vegeta. So what do you guys expect from the Humans?

As a SSJ you made good enough dmg to not complain (if you had the right gear etc.) Some ppl knew how to use it right (in dungeons or pvp) while others just transformed to look "better" or feel op.

And i agree with Xicer even if it sounds harsh. If ppl haven't played the game then they shouldn't make suggestions cuz others will destroy them with facts xD
*click for original size*

SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #8 on: September 09, 2014, 06:59:21 AM »

    Offline LordSchmee

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I'm making suggestions based on observation from multiple different players of the game. I'm merely funneling other peoples suggestions into the one place, nothing more.

And yes. In the series. Is it such a strange and unusual thing for me to want a vital aspect of the series to be represented at least somewhat faithfully in a game based on the series?
I'm not even asking for a huge power boost. Just something to make it more worthwhile than I've heard it is. I've seen many threads suggesting to forget SSJ and just go for KK instead.

As for the "the genepool is diluted" thing... it was established in the series that SSJ doesn't decrease in power with less saiya-jin DNA (in fact it seemed to get stronger and easier to achieve). I could maybe take that as an excuse to balance the game, but not to nerf the transformation entirely.

The fact remains that it's still a Dragonball wish, and it's still about as useful as a vanilla ability, greatly skewing the effort:reward ratio far in favour of the effort margin.

 From both a gameplay and a lore standpoint, it fails.

SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #9 on: September 09, 2014, 07:05:12 AM »

    Offline Iceman

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I'm making suggestions based on observation from multiple different players of the game. I'm merely funneling other peoples suggestions into the one place, nothing more.

And yes. In the series. Is it such a strange and unusual thing for me to want a vital aspect of the series to be represented at least somewhat faithfully in a game based on the series?
I'm not even asking for a huge power boost. Just something to make it more worthwhile than I've heard it is. I've seen many threads suggesting to forget SSJ and just go for KK instead.

As for the "the genepool is diluted" thing... it was established in the series that SSJ doesn't decrease in power with less saiya-jin DNA (in fact it seemed to get stronger and easier to achieve). I could maybe take that as an excuse to balance the game, but not to nerf the transformation entirely.

The fact remains that it's still a Dragonball wish, and it's still about as useful as a vanilla ability, greatly skewing the effort:reward ratio far in favour of the effort margin.

 From both a gameplay and a lore standpoint, it fails.

Look mate. SSJ was good and if you think that with turtle you can dodge things, well good luck that.
When you make char, look what you wana be.
Fan boy who wana blast things with kame aka turtle or fighter who will dodge attack... You can't be both.

I will say one more, SSJ is good as it is.
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SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #10 on: September 09, 2014, 07:06:33 AM »

    Offline Xicer

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I'm making suggestions based on observation from multiple different players of the game. I'm merely funneling other peoples suggestions into the one place, nothing more.

And yes. In the series. Is it such a strange and unusual thing for me to want a vital aspect of the series to be represented at least somewhat faithfully in a game based on the series?
I'm not even asking for a huge power boost. Just something to make it more worthwhile than I've heard it is. I've seen many threads suggesting to forget SSJ and just go for KK instead.

As for the "the genepool is diluted" thing... it was established in the series that SSJ doesn't decrease in power with less saiya-jin DNA (in fact it seemed to get stronger and easier to achieve). I could maybe take that as an excuse to balance the game, but not to nerf the transformation entirely.

The fact remains that it's still a Dragonball wish, and it's still about as useful as a vanilla ability, greatly skewing the effort:reward ratio far in favour of the effort margin.

 From both a gameplay and a lore standpoint, it fails.

Lol mate you didn't play the game so you don't understand how good or bad it was, you're basing this on what a couple of people said. Ssj was op the way it was and giving it a power boost would unbalance the game even more than it was.

SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #11 on: September 09, 2014, 07:07:07 AM »
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I'm making suggestions based on observation from multiple different players of the game. I'm merely funneling other peoples suggestions into the one place, nothing more.

And yes. In the series. Is it such a strange and unusual thing for me to want a vital aspect of the series to be represented at least somewhat faithfully in a game based on the series?
I'm not even asking for a huge power boost. Just something to make it more worthwhile than I've heard it is. I've seen many threads suggesting to forget SSJ and just go for KK instead.

As for the "the genepool is diluted" thing... it was established in the series that SSJ doesn't decrease in power with less saiya-jin DNA (in fact it seemed to get stronger and easier to achieve). I could maybe take that as an excuse to balance the game, but not to nerf the transformation entirely.

The fact remains that it's still a Dragonball wish, and it's still about as useful as a vanilla ability, greatly skewing the effort:reward ratio far in favour of the effort margin.

 From both a gameplay and a lore standpoint, it fails.
I agree, the genepool doesn't have much to do with it as Goten and Trunks, who had half the Saiyan DNA their fathers had, were capable of great things and had excellent fighting prowess, and Gohan, well, when he had his powers awakened, he was stronger than Goku himself (as long as he doesn't use the Genki Dama). I agree that SSJ should be a bit stronger considering the time limit.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2014, 07:09:08 AM by SuperSaiyan2 »

SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #12 on: September 09, 2014, 07:09:33 AM »

    Offline LordSchmee

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@Xicer: I'm not basing it on what "a couple people said", I'm basing it on what the vast majority of "SSJ vs Kaio-ken" threads say. The vast majority of people have said SSJ is mostly useless and Kaio-ken is superior. Which shouldn't happen for an ability you have to wish for.

@Iceman: I don't really care about dodging, I'm just looking into the mechanical aspects of the ability as well as the lore aspects.

@SuperSaiyan2: Thanks for the supporting comment. :) @Vegito Mystic too.

SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #13 on: September 09, 2014, 07:15:30 AM »

    Offline Iceman

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Lol mate you didn't play the game so you don't understand how good or bad it was, you're basing this on what a couple of people said. Ssj was op the way it was and giving it a power boost would unbalance the game even more than it was.

I agree what Xicer said.

SSJ is good as it is.
People who say that isn't good, they didn't know to play game.
Kaioken is better because of CD and because you can use it over and over again.
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SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #14 on: September 09, 2014, 07:17:29 AM »

    Offline Xicer

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It doesn't matter what the vast majority of the thread says you didn't experience it so you don't get to say that it isn't good enough or that it should be changed.

SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #15 on: September 09, 2014, 07:18:57 AM »

    Offline MaxJr

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I just want the game as it was <3 and ssj wasn't useless.... cmon... for turtle farm is op, for fighters and sword is more dodge, speed etc... if you guys want that with ssj you become unthouchable is better that you play offline :P
If you need crits, more attack and you have a party, you should use kok.
If you need more dodge, no lp drain or you want to farm, you should use ssj. It's already ok I think.
Waiting for the return of DBO =D



SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #16 on: September 09, 2014, 07:20:56 AM »

    Offline LordSchmee

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I don't get to say "my experience leads me to believe" or "I believe" it should be changed, but I'm well within my rights to say "from the information I've found, the vast majority of players participating in discussions about SSJ vs KK feel that SSJ is nigh on useless".

The only people I've seen suggest otherwise are the exact same people who were against having a separate female Pure Majin model. One might hypothesize that some players simply don't want the game to change any from how it was when they played it, regardless of its flaws.

SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #17 on: September 09, 2014, 07:24:05 AM »

    Offline Iceman

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I don't get to say "my experience leads me to believe" or "I believe" it should be changed, but I'm well within my rights to say "from the information I've found, the vast majority of players participating in discussions about SSJ vs KK feel that SSJ is nigh on useless".

The only people I've seen suggest otherwise are the exact same people who were against having a separate female Pure Majin model. One might hypothesize that some players simply don't want the game to change any from how it was when they played it, regardless of its flaws.

You get it!!!!!
We want DBO with little more balance and less bugs!!!
If you people don't want this game, go find better game...
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SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #18 on: September 09, 2014, 07:24:51 AM »

    Offline Ren

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Since when did Super Saiyan have a time limit ???.

SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #19 on: September 09, 2014, 07:25:02 AM »

    Offline Spark

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I don't get to say "my experience leads me to believe" or "I believe" it should be changed, but I'm well within my rights to say "from the information I've found, the vast majority of players participating in discussions about SSJ vs KK feel that SSJ is nigh on useless".

The only people I've seen suggest otherwise are the exact same people who were against having a separate female Pure Majin model. One might hypothesize that some players simply don't want the game to change any from how it was when they played it, regardless of its flaws.
You keep saying vast majority when its like 2 people agreeing with you...

Anyway name 5 people who think the same :(


Poof

SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #20 on: September 09, 2014, 07:25:11 AM »

    Offline SSJGGoku

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I've heard about Kaioken being more powerful than Super Saiyan in-game. Kaioken is more of a damage booster and Super Saiyan boosts all your skills including the damage. With Kaioken, you get lp and ep drain and with Super Saiyan, you get only ep drain. Kaioken was more useful for Martial Artist because they had more health than the Spiritualist. The Spiritualist were better for Super Saiyan because it lasted longer. Super Saiyan is fine as it is.

Post Merge: September 09, 2014, 07:25:54 AM
Since when did Super Saiyan have a time limit ???.
I think he's confusing it with the cooldown of Super Saiyan

Special thanks to Kaiza for this awesome sig!

SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #21 on: September 09, 2014, 07:26:09 AM »
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Since when did Super Saiyan have a time limit ???.
One can consider the energy drain as a time limit, especially for Fighters/Swordsman.

SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #22 on: September 09, 2014, 07:27:39 AM »

    Offline Iceman

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I've heard about Kaioken being more powerful than Super Saiyan in-game. Kaioken is more of a damage booster and Super Saiyan boosts all your skills including the damage. With Kaioken, you get lp and ep drain and with Super Saiyan, you get only ep drain. Kaioken was more useful for Martial Artist because they had more health than the Spiritualist. The Spiritualist were better for Super Saiyan because it lasted longer. Super Saiyan is fine as it is.

Post Merge: September 09, 2014, 07:25:54 AM
I think he's confusing it with the cooldown of Super Saiyan

SSJ and Kaioken was better for Spiritualist.
They had more EP and LP.
That is Crane had more EP and LP than any human class.
But I agree other things you said.
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SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #23 on: September 09, 2014, 07:28:51 AM »

    Offline SSJGGoku

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One can consider the energy drain as a time limit, especially for Fighters/Swordsman.
Oh yeah. A few skills and then your energy was nearly gone..

Special thanks to Kaiza for this awesome sig!

SSJ Usefulness
« Reply #24 on: September 09, 2014, 07:30:23 AM »

    Offline Iceman

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One can consider the energy drain as a time limit, especially for Fighters/Swordsman.

Oh yeah. A few skills and then your energy was nearly gone..

LP and EP auto pots.... Then there is food and other LP/EP pots...
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